Comments on: Unengaged: How Gen Y is Failing the University System

By: More Practical Lessons, Less Theory

More Practical Lessons, Less Theory — Thu, 04 Feb 2010 23:58:11 +0000

[...] is what is hurting students. Ellen Nordahl looks at the problem from the other side in her post about how students are unengaged. Universities need to teach students more skills they will use in the workplace or they will not [...]

By: Removing Roadblocks: How Universities Can Smooth the College-to-Career Transition

Thu, 04 Feb 2010 19:22:07 +0000

[...] the responses generated by Unengaged, I started thinking about additional resources that could have left me better equipped to begin [...]

By: Rob

Rob — Thu, 04 Feb 2010 14:09:46 +0000

Ellen,

Good read. I look forward to more. It is, as you might imagine, equally frustrating to be the professor trying to start said discussion. I think its partly fear of looking silly/insecurity rather than simply lack of interest/motivation though. There is clearly a big chunk of the latter though.

By: Ellen Nordahl

Ellen Nordahl — Thu, 04 Feb 2010 03:50:03 +0000

@Nathan – I love your point about intellectual curiosity slowly leaking out of the student population, and the sense of entitlement that comes with a diploma. I’ve been giving a lot of thought to the points everyone has raised about college career services being slow to adapt; I had a pretty narrow frame of reference (The UW Business School’s career services) in mind when I wrote this post. Thinking about my friend’s experiences with the career offices of different colleges within the UW has made me realize that the quality of the career services I had access to seems to be an exception to the rule.

@Jim – I still feel bitter about a lot of “slackers” that managed to land a job in this economy when I still feel a bit out to sea. I also admit to not being a model student – I hated chemistry and rarely went to class, but that’s what it took for me to realize that I really had no interest in becoming a doctor. Once I found my niche, I feltAs for activities that would help you land a career – it’s never too late to start. I mean, if people can tout leadership skills they’ve built by being a guild leader in World of Warcraft (and yes, I’m completely serious) to help land a job, I’m sure you can find something to leverage. Thanks for reading!

By: Jim

Jim — Thu, 04 Feb 2010 00:05:37 +0000

What really gets me is some of the people I considered “bottom of the barrel” have careers now, and I don’t. Unfortunately I can’t say I took college all that seriously myself. I tried in the classes I enjoyed and slacked in the classes I didn’t. I failed to pursue any activities that would have helped place me in a career, at the perfect time to engage in those activities. On the other hand, a decent chunk of my college experience was a complete waste of time. Bowling was a fun class, but…
I had a few more relevant things to say but I forgot, anyway, good blog, very well written. Looking forward to more.

By: Nathan Lustig

Nathan Lustig — Wed, 03 Feb 2010 22:03:04 +0000

Good post. I think today’s students are way too focused on simply getting good grades and view their diploma as a piece of paper that “should” guarantee them a good job when they graduate.

College doesn’t look like it did in movies and books from the 50s-70s. Somewhere in there, students started treating a college degree as their next step on their way to a good job. They didn’t care about intellectual curiosity that had been the bedrock of college education for decades.

This attitude worked really well when companies really needed employees, but doesn’t work in a down economy.

Overall, I think its a combination of students believing that they are entitled to a fun college experience, at least a 3.0 and a good job when they graduate, coupled with colleges being way to slow adapt by actually preparing students for the real world with real skills.

By: JR Moreau

JR Moreau — Wed, 03 Feb 2010 19:47:28 +0000

Ellen, to be honest, college got me out of a lifestyle that I wasn’t happy with and allowed me to do more things with my mind, rather than head towards a career in the trades. I wouldn’t trade the path I took for all the money in the world. However, I feel like I could have gotten a lot more out of college besides personal growth, which may or may not have happened if I took a different path. Would I be more satisfied if I had gone to a better school? Possibly… but i feel like the effort I put in was always above average, so I’m content with that. I just don’t know if what colleges give back on the whole is proportional to the amount people pay to go there.

By: Ellen Nordahl

Ellen Nordahl — Wed, 03 Feb 2010 19:08:51 +0000

It was maddening when professors would try to encourage some healthy discussion and the same 2 people in a lecture of 50 were the only ones to pipe up. Thanks for reading (and for the post that was my food for thought), Rebecca!

By: Rebecca

Rebecca — Wed, 03 Feb 2010 17:55:20 +0000

Great post, Elle. I agree that probably one of my more frustrating moments in college was when I wanted to have a heated debate and talk about the issues and my classmates could have cared less. Where’s the passion? I disagree with JR that it’s the bottom of the barrel that you’re speaking about. These students are the the masses walking to class every day – just look at their faces.

By: Luke Berg

Luke Berg — Wed, 03 Feb 2010 05:35:22 +0000

I have to agree with JR that I each of your points are good and correct but I disagree with the connection. I had to do a fair amount of thinking before I knew what I really thought about your post as education is something I’m rather passionate about.

So my whole response is really a corollary to all three points in your blog but redirects some of the finger pointing of sorts I think. An important point to keep in mind with college is that students are paying for the opportunity at an education. It is the colleges job to provide a quality product ( education, career services, networking, etc ), but in the end the students need to take advantage of the opportunities. You are completely right in that the students need to grow up and realize the work required, ought to value good classes over easy classes and have no excuse to cheat.

The real analogy that made me think of this is, it makes no difference to Microsoft if I buy 1000 copies of Windows and use it for a 1000 person company or if I just buy the copies and sit them on my shelf. I get a hell of a lot more value if I actually use them and I expect that if I do use the copies that they work well ( ok MS might not be a good example but I think you get the idea ). I think that education is similar.

As I am starting to write this response, I’m reminded of the “You must have Cheated” post over at Art of Great Things. http://bit.ly/dgtKO2 The folks that got jobs at GE or Intuit are either going to be in for a rude awakening and possibly a firing, or maybe they’ll bust their ass and play catch up once they realize what happened. Have you kept in touch with the folks that you are talking about? Just curious.

Also, I’ll stop back and keep reading for the month. I think 28 days for Feb is actually a rather cool idea.